Comments on: Thoughts on Farmville, an addictive but flawed Facebook game http://www.techiteasy.org/2010/01/12/thoughts-on-farmville-an-addictive-but-flawed-facebook-game-2/ A Technology and Business Weblog provided to You by a Global Group of Friends. Sun, 24 Oct 2010 12:09:47 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: Tech IT Easy » FarmVille is a role playing game http://www.techiteasy.org/2010/01/12/thoughts-on-farmville-an-addictive-but-flawed-facebook-game-2/#comment-6052 Tech IT Easy » FarmVille is a role playing game Fri, 05 Feb 2010 07:52:43 +0000 http://www.techiteasy.org/?p=2706#comment-6052 [...] is a role playing game By Kari Silvennoinen, February 5, 2010 As I argued in the comments in Vincent’s post about FarmVille, FarmVille is a role playing game (RPG). And pretty bad one at that. Like most RPGs, you [...] [...] is a role playing game By Kari Silvennoinen, February 5, 2010 As I argued in the comments in Vincent’s post about FarmVille, FarmVille is a role playing game (RPG). And pretty bad one at that. Like most RPGs, you [...]

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By: Tech IT Easy » My computing context and what I think about the iPad http://www.techiteasy.org/2010/01/12/thoughts-on-farmville-an-addictive-but-flawed-facebook-game-2/#comment-5935 Tech IT Easy » My computing context and what I think about the iPad Sat, 30 Jan 2010 10:33:43 +0000 http://www.techiteasy.org/?p=2706#comment-5935 [...] even from a €0.79 game on the Touch or iPhone isn’t going back to freeware flash (read my Farmville review as an [...] [...] even from a €0.79 game on the Touch or iPhone isn’t going back to freeware flash (read my Farmville review as an [...]

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By: Vincent van Wylick http://www.techiteasy.org/2010/01/12/thoughts-on-farmville-an-addictive-but-flawed-facebook-game-2/#comment-5873 Vincent van Wylick Tue, 26 Jan 2010 19:31:59 +0000 http://www.techiteasy.org/?p=2706#comment-5873 I think Flash is fine, more or less. It has its flaws, but it's (seems) easy to develop for and is obviously ubiquitous when talking about webapps. So, from a business perspective it makes sense. That said, I'd love a lighter iPhone version, as it really would make for a great mobile app. As it is now, it's super-bloated and not that great in terms of the technical features of the game (may be a development shortcoming, I don't know). I think Flash is fine, more or less. It has its flaws, but it's (seems) easy to develop for and is obviously ubiquitous when talking about webapps. So, from a business perspective it makes sense. That said, I'd love a lighter iPhone version, as it really would make for a great mobile app. As it is now, it's super-bloated and not that great in terms of the technical features of the game (may be a development shortcoming, I don't know).

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By: Ian http://www.techiteasy.org/2010/01/12/thoughts-on-farmville-an-addictive-but-flawed-facebook-game-2/#comment-5871 Ian Tue, 26 Jan 2010 09:53:45 +0000 http://www.techiteasy.org/?p=2706#comment-5871 Great article - regards comments on Flash, what would you recommend as a better way to have done this type of app? and why? Great article – regards comments on Flash, what would you recommend as a better way to have done this type of app? and why?

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By: Vincent van Wylick http://www.techiteasy.org/2010/01/12/thoughts-on-farmville-an-addictive-but-flawed-facebook-game-2/#comment-5643 Vincent van Wylick Tue, 12 Jan 2010 17:37:59 +0000 http://www.techiteasy.org/?p=2706#comment-5643 Actually I also noticed your ROI-calculated field, which also told me something (good) about you. :) I did the same, though tried to make it a somewhat nice place also. All the way to my flowery "I QUIT." And your point 2: 200% agreed. It's a sign of the times I think. Hard to make money with a flash game and thus annoy your users to pay? Actually I also noticed your ROI-calculated field, which also told me something (good) about you. :) I did the same, though tried to make it a somewhat nice place also. All the way to my flowery "I QUIT."

And your point 2: 200% agreed. It's a sign of the times I think. Hard to make money with a flash game and thus annoy your users to pay?

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By: Vincent van Wylick http://www.techiteasy.org/2010/01/12/thoughts-on-farmville-an-addictive-but-flawed-facebook-game-2/#comment-5642 Vincent van Wylick Tue, 12 Jan 2010 17:32:34 +0000 http://www.techiteasy.org/?p=2706#comment-5642 You comment sort of got lost in our spam folder for half a day, but we are completely on the same wavelength! :) You comment sort of got lost in our spam folder for half a day, but we are completely on the same wavelength! :)

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By: kari http://www.techiteasy.org/2010/01/12/thoughts-on-farmville-an-addictive-but-flawed-facebook-game-2/#comment-5641 kari Tue, 12 Jan 2010 16:59:33 +0000 http://www.techiteasy.org/?p=2706#comment-5641 I never really thought about the farms as a form of self-expression, but now that you mentioned it, it does make sense. It probably does tell something about me (that I'm boring?) that my field is filled to the brim with just the most ROI-yielding crops (I confess, I did some investment calculations…) What I find worrying, however, is the tendency in these games that they limit your ability express yourself unless you're willing to pay. This of course is the business logic behind these games, but I do find it somewhat depressing. There are some literature in different player types in multiplayer games (achievers, etc), but they escape me know. I never really thought about the farms as a form of self-expression, but now that you mentioned it, it does make sense. It probably does tell something about me (that I'm boring?) that my field is filled to the brim with just the most ROI-yielding crops (I confess, I did some investment calculations…)

What I find worrying, however, is the tendency in these games that they limit your ability express yourself unless you're willing to pay. This of course is the business logic behind these games, but I do find it somewhat depressing.

There are some literature in different player types in multiplayer games (achievers, etc), but they escape me know.

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By: Vincent van Wylick http://www.techiteasy.org/2010/01/12/thoughts-on-farmville-an-addictive-but-flawed-facebook-game-2/#comment-5639 Vincent van Wylick Tue, 12 Jan 2010 13:25:37 +0000 http://www.techiteasy.org/?p=2706#comment-5639 In response to your question of how much communication occurred between us, I respond that not all communication happens via text or pictures, but there is tremendous depth in non-verbal communication such as gift-giving. Especially considering the current season, it seems relevant. :) By playing a game with your friends, especially one that allows you to create something like a farming landscape, you get an insight into what those friends value. One of my female friends was at level 35, had a gigantic farm, with a gigantic mansion, and many of those signs that visitors can leave. I hadn't seen her in 10 years, but I remember that she was always very social and status orientated, which is actually something I value in her. Another friend had a lot of animals, sheltered away elegantly, which gave me the idea that she cared for those kind of things. Since I didn't know her that well, it added value which a status or picture might not have. That's what I mean with the 'social dynamic' that Farmville gave me over regular Facebook. …But perhaps I'm also reading more into it than there was. To me Farmville seemed more like Gardenville, where you would actually create nice landscapes for your friend to visit. And, as any garden lover will tell you, their work (or lack of) is also a way of communicating with the outside world, just like any "welcome" or "keep out" sign. My 2 cents, though I still think that on all other dimensions the game had flaws. In response to your question of how much communication occurred between us, I respond that not all communication happens via text or pictures, but there is tremendous depth in non-verbal communication such as gift-giving. Especially considering the current season, it seems relevant. :)

By playing a game with your friends, especially one that allows you to create something like a farming landscape, you get an insight into what those friends value. One of my female friends was at level 35, had a gigantic farm, with a gigantic mansion, and many of those signs that visitors can leave. I hadn't seen her in 10 years, but I remember that she was always very social and status orientated, which is actually something I value in her. Another friend had a lot of animals, sheltered away elegantly, which gave me the idea that she cared for those kind of things. Since I didn't know her that well, it added value which a status or picture might not have. That's what I mean with the 'social dynamic' that Farmville gave me over regular Facebook. …But perhaps I'm also reading more into it than there was.

To me Farmville seemed more like Gardenville, where you would actually create nice landscapes for your friend to visit. And, as any garden lover will tell you, their work (or lack of) is also a way of communicating with the outside world, just like any "welcome" or "keep out" sign.

My 2 cents, though I still think that on all other dimensions the game had flaws.

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By: kari http://www.techiteasy.org/2010/01/12/thoughts-on-farmville-an-addictive-but-flawed-facebook-game-2/#comment-5632 kari Tue, 12 Jan 2010 09:08:15 +0000 http://www.techiteasy.org/?p=2706#comment-5632 Great post, Vince. I share many of your frustrations about the FarmVille. I also have fond memories of SimFarm, but comparing FarmVille to it doesn't make any justice. SimFarm actually had depth. Also, I'm really worried about people who think these are "social" games. One of the major problems with this kind of RPGs - yes, I categorize FarmVille as a role-playing game. Mostly because of the game mechanics. - is that everyone gets the same experience and there's no difficulty. By playing FarmVille, you don't get any skills and you the only thing that makes you better in the game is the time you use (leveling up and thus getting access to better equipment). Even Doom 2 and Need for Speed 2 were more social when I was growing up, because you could share your scores and experiences. Not so in FarmVille, where it always takes exactly 24 hours to grow grapes and that's about it. Vince, how much communication or social interactions we had playing that game? Except for the parts that felt like laboratory tests for game theoretical reciprocity behaviour on humans (ie. gifts and fertilizing crops). If those are someone's idea of "social interaction", they're pretty isolated and sad persons indeed. Those actions have zero to do with altruistic "helping" as there are incentives set that you benefit from helping anyone. See the many groups where people friend others solely to advance faster in FarmVille and how people will fertilize your "I quit" crops indefinitely. Oh well, this comment is getting way too long... I think I need to write a companion post to yours =) Great post, Vince.

I share many of your frustrations about the FarmVille. I also have fond memories of SimFarm, but comparing FarmVille to it doesn't make any justice. SimFarm actually had depth. Also, I'm really worried about people who think these are "social" games.

One of the major problems with this kind of RPGs – yes, I categorize FarmVille as a role-playing game. Mostly because of the game mechanics. – is that everyone gets the same experience and there's no difficulty. By playing FarmVille, you don't get any skills and you the only thing that makes you better in the game is the time you use (leveling up and thus getting access to better equipment). Even Doom 2 and Need for Speed 2 were more social when I was growing up, because you could share your scores and experiences. Not so in FarmVille, where it always takes exactly 24 hours to grow grapes and that's about it.

Vince, how much communication or social interactions we had playing that game? Except for the parts that felt like laboratory tests for game theoretical reciprocity behaviour on humans (ie. gifts and fertilizing crops). If those are someone's idea of "social interaction", they're pretty isolated and sad persons indeed. Those actions have zero to do with altruistic "helping" as there are incentives set that you benefit from helping anyone. See the many groups where people friend others solely to advance faster in FarmVille and how people will fertilize your "I quit" crops indefinitely.

Oh well, this comment is getting way too long… I think I need to write a companion post to yours =)

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By: Fidji http://www.techiteasy.org/2010/01/12/thoughts-on-farmville-an-addictive-but-flawed-facebook-game-2/#comment-5630 Fidji Tue, 12 Jan 2010 07:43:59 +0000 http://www.techiteasy.org/?p=2706#comment-5630 Vince, does that mean I won't receive those awesome Farmville gifts from you anymore? ;-) Personally, my addiction profile is very low (it's very tough to get me hooked on something), but the one thing I like about Farmville is the "artistic" piece: you said it in your post, it's all about having the prettiest farm. And somehow it encourages creativity in terms of placing stuff, buying nice items, growing nice flowers etc. As artistic forms become more and more and mashup and repurposing of existing pieces of art, I see Farmville as a good example of this trend. That was actually the topic of the tweet that got you started (sorry for that :-D): I was saying that on my first visit, I did not see the point in Farmville until I got to see the awesome farms that my friends were putting together. So I see Farmville as an interesting experiment in that sense... but in the end I'm like you: after playing for 10 minutes, I always wonder what I have accomplished and if there would be a better use of my time, and the next thing I do is just close Famville and go get a life :-) Vince, does that mean I won’t receive those awesome Farmville gifts from you anymore? ;-)
Personally, my addiction profile is very low (it’s very tough to get me hooked on something), but the one thing I like about Farmville is the “artistic” piece: you said it in your post, it’s all about having the prettiest farm. And somehow it encourages creativity in terms of placing stuff, buying nice items, growing nice flowers etc. As artistic forms become more and more and mashup and repurposing of existing pieces of art, I see Farmville as a good example of this trend.
That was actually the topic of the tweet that got you started (sorry for that :-D ): I was saying that on my first visit, I did not see the point in Farmville until I got to see the awesome farms that my friends were putting together.
So I see Farmville as an interesting experiment in that sense… but in the end I’m like you: after playing for 10 minutes, I always wonder what I have accomplished and if there would be a better use of my time, and the next thing I do is just close Famville and go get a life :-)

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